Test Equipment Anonymous

MED6753 wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2024 11:51 pm

tggzzz wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2024 7:17 pm
We can't throw stones in that regard

The current fashion is to blame "ultraprocessed foods", which are as well defined and understood as Dark Energy and Dark Matter and Luminiferous Æther.

It's actually quite simple. Ultraprocessed foods, too many carbs, too much sugar. Result: A nation of blimps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tz9OJyyJrBQ

How long was she in the shop for to consume so much food that she couldn't fit through the door that she must have entered through?

tggzzz wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 12:33 am

vk6zgo wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 12:30 am

tggzzz wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2024 11:25 am

Iff the burger has flavour in the first place. But I tend to agree.

I certainly wouldn't put good cheese in a burger or toastie, since I like a good cheese's flavour and (especially) texture. The MacDonalds stuff had neither, and I couldn't detect any redeeming virtue.

In the same way that much ice cream should be called "ice non-dairy-fat-whitener", so that stuff should be called something like "edible-vinyl-flooring".

Those of us "furrinners" who experienced the horror of English fast food in the 1970s could only regard the advent of MacDonalds & the like as a radical leap forward in the food scene in that "green & pleasant land".

Waddayou mean? You didn't like Wimpys?

It is difficult for youngsters to begin to comprehend how much has improved since the 60s.

What about the Golden Egg, they were good as well.

tggzzz wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2024 6:47 pm I expect UK mice would turn their noses up at MacDonald's "cheese".

I can show you a polythene board eaten by English mice. They'd love McD's "cheese".

Cerebus wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 4:14 pm

tggzzz wrote: ↑Wed May 08, 2024 6:47 pm I expect UK mice would turn their noses up at MacDonald's "cheese".

I can show you a polythene board eaten by English mice. They'd love McD's "cheese".

Yup. At the same time an egg and cheese McMuffin, couple of hash browns, a black coffee followed by an M&S apple turnover and a Costa hot chocolate chaser is a good start to a day hike . The cheese really makes it when congealed to the egg.

(disclaimer: 25km+ only )

So I hired an EV and so far it's not as bad as I thought it was going to be. The current experience was based on a 2018 Tesla Model S P100D which was a horrible pile of shite. This time it's a Polestar 2. Only picked this up because Hertz were doing a deal which made it considerably cheaper to hire than even a Fiat 500. At £159 for 4 days, why the hell not? Anyway the Polestar is a mid-range "made in China" EV designed by Volvo and Geely.

Nothing really notable other than some surprising outliers for the car industry. Firstly it still has proper tactile controls for everything and they are all in the correct places. Secondly the in-car entertainment system actually worked when I plugged it into my phone. That in itself is a first after dealing with both Vauxhall and Citroen's turds. The fit and finish is really good - no complaints. Driving it is "interesting". I've mostly been using single pedal mode which takes a little getting used to but is safe and effective.

Looks not too cheap


Action shot - not taken by me I will add. I was busy concentrating on the road.


Anyway I thought I'd write this up because I rarely don't complain about something and I am not complaining about this

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 6:50 am I've mostly been using single pedal mode which takes a little getting used to but is safe and effective.

I had to look up what that is. Turns out I've been doing it for decades

"Playing games" like that is one trick I use to help keep my mind on driving

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 8:48 am

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 6:50 am I've mostly been using single pedal mode which takes a little getting used to but is safe and effective.

I had to look up what that is. Turns out I've been doing it for decades

"Playing games" like that is one trick I use to help keep my mind on driving

Well it works slightly different to an automatic would. If you completely take your foot off it comes to a complete halt with no creeping so you can navigate multiple traffic light stops just on the accelerator.

Stomping on the brake pedal is still available should a fuckwit occur.

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 9:37 am Well it works slightly different to an automatic would. If you completely take your foot off it comes to a complete halt with no creeping so you can navigate multiple traffic light stops just on the accelerator.

The downside, compared to using it in two pedal mode, is that you lose control of your brake light as a deliberate signal and you don't know how enthusiastic the car is in putting the brake light on for what would be in a conventional setup mild engine braking. In some EVs it can result in your brake lights flickering as if you're a jumpy idiot who keeps hopping between brake and accelerator - something which I take as a warning sign when I notice drivers doing it.

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 6:50 am
Anyway I thought I'd write this up because I rarely don't complain about something and I am not complaining about this

I'd complain. The steering wheel is on the wrong side. No wonder it's cheap.

Cerebus wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 12:42 pm

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 9:37 am Well it works slightly different to an automatic would. If you completely take your foot off it comes to a complete halt with no creeping so you can navigate multiple traffic light stops just on the accelerator.

The downside, compared to using it in two pedal mode, is that you lose control of your brake light as a deliberate signal and you don't know how enthusiastic the car is in putting the brake light on for what would be in a conventional setup mild engine braking. In some EVs it can result in your brake lights flickering as if you're a jumpy idiot who keeps hopping between brake and accelerator - something which I take as a warning sign when I notice drivers doing it.

Meh don't drive up my arse and don't find out

MED6753 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 2:40 pm

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 6:50 am
Anyway I thought I'd write this up because I rarely don't complain about something and I am not complaining about this

I'd complain. The steering wheel is on the wrong side. No wonder it's cheap.

Having actually driven on the correct side of the road now for a reasonable distance (1800 miles) I would be inclined to agree with you.

There I said it. I will now be shunned by my fellow countrymen

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 3:36 pm Meh don't drive up my arse and don't find out

When people do that to me, it is remarkable noticeable how erratic my speed becomes.

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 6:50 am So I hired an EV and so far it's not as bad as I thought it was going to be.

If I did that, would they give me a smartphone with all the apps I might discover I need to refuel the thing?

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 4:10 pm

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 6:50 am So I hired an EV and so far it's not as bad as I thought it was going to be.

If I did that, would they give me a smartphone with all the apps I might discover I need to refuel the thing?

Actually it's really easy. You park it up in front of the charger. Plug it in with the fat cable on the charger and just touch your debit card on it and say how much you want it filled up to. It gives you the total price and a countdown and you press ok.

You can make things complicated but I suspect you don't need to.

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 4:17 pm

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 4:10 pm

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 6:50 am So I hired an EV and so far it's not as bad as I thought it was going to be.

If I did that, would they give me a smartphone with all the apps I might discover I need to refuel the thing?

Actually it's really easy. You park it up in front of the charger. Plug it in with the fat cable on the charger and just touch your debit card on it and say how much you want it filled up to. It gives you the total price and a countdown and you press ok.

You can make things complicated but I suspect you don't need to.

That seem so sane that I'm suspicious.

Does that work at all charging points, or do you have to locate one of a subset of nearby ones?

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 4:21 pm

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 4:17 pm

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 4:10 pm

If I did that, would they give me a smartphone with all the apps I might discover I need to refuel the thing?

Actually it's really easy. You park it up in front of the charger. Plug it in with the fat cable on the charger and just touch your debit card on it and say how much you want it filled up to. It gives you the total price and a countdown and you press ok.

You can make things complicated but I suspect you don't need to.

That seem so sane that I'm suspicious.

Does that work at all charging points, or do you have to locate one of a subset of nearby ones?

No idea. It was an InstaVolt one at Syon Park and you pay contactless. The kWh rate is terrible but that's public charging for you. I only put 10kWh in as an experiment to make sure it worked before I do a long journey tomorrow.

The charging situation is quite frankly shit though really. The high power chargers are expensive and rare or Tesla only. If people want this to work there needs to be a race to the bottom on pricing.

Edit financials...

6.54p a mile if you charge at home.

20.2p a mile if you charge at a public charger.

BUT

8.8p a mile if you buy a Citroen C3 1.0 and use unleaded fuel. Plus the vehicle has a considerably lower TCO and depreciation than ANY EV.

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 3:36 pm

Cerebus wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 12:42 pm

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 9:37 am Well it works slightly different to an automatic would. If you completely take your foot off it comes to a complete halt with no creeping so you can navigate multiple traffic light stops just on the accelerator.

The downside, compared to using it in two pedal mode, is that you lose control of your brake light as a deliberate signal and you don't know how enthusiastic the car is in putting the brake light on for what would be in a conventional setup mild engine braking. In some EVs it can result in your brake lights flickering as if you're a jumpy idiot who keeps hopping between brake and accelerator - something which I take as a warning sign when I notice drivers doing it.

Meh don't drive up my arse and don't find out

It's got nothing to do with driving up anybody's arse but about what you're communicating to other drivers - brake lights are as much a signal as indicators are. Use them well and you help other drivers, badly and you confuse them (and some are bloody easy to confuse). I don't like the idea of abrogating control of them to the car.

Cerebus wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 5:53 pm It's got nothing to do with driving up anybody's arse but about what you're communicating to other drivers - brake lights are as much a signal as indicators are. Use them well and you help other drivers, badly and you confuse them (and some are bloody easy to confuse). I don't like the idea of abrogating control of them to the car.

Which raises another question about self-driving cars, or cars where the turn indicator controls are vestigial. What is the sequence of events when the car or driver decides to change lane?

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 6:42 pm

Cerebus wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 5:53 pm It's got nothing to do with driving up anybody's arse but about what you're communicating to other drivers - brake lights are as much a signal as indicators are. Use them well and you help other drivers, badly and you confuse them (and some are bloody easy to confuse). I don't like the idea of abrogating control of them to the car.

Which raises another question about self-driving cars, or cars where the turn indicator controls are vestigial. What is the sequence of events when the car or driver decides to change lane?

The cars still work the same as they always did.

I am personally more worried about shitty light cluster designs in some vehicles where you can't tell if it's a headlight or an indicator.

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 9:54 pm

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 6:42 pm

Cerebus wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 5:53 pm It's got nothing to do with driving up anybody's arse but about what you're communicating to other drivers - brake lights are as much a signal as indicators are. Use them well and you help other drivers, badly and you confuse them (and some are bloody easy to confuse). I don't like the idea of abrogating control of them to the car.

Which raises another question about self-driving cars, or cars where the turn indicator controls are vestigial. What is the sequence of events when the car or driver decides to change lane?

The cars still work the same as they always did.

The ML indicates before changing lanes?

ISTR there was something about some card not having indicator stalks, but buttons where sometimes you pressed a left button before turning right, and vice versa,

I am personally more worried about shitty light cluster designs in some vehicles where you can't tell if it's a headlight or an indicator.

There are some where the indicator is small, in the middle of the head/parking light, and effectively not visible until it is too late to do anything about seeing it. There used to be standards, but that seems too passeé nowadays

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 10:54 pm

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 9:54 pm

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 6:42 pm

Which raises another question about self-driving cars, or cars where the turn indicator controls are vestigial. What is the sequence of events when the car or driver decides to change lane?

The cars still work the same as they always did.

The ML indicates before changing lanes?

ISTR there was something about some card not having indicator stalks, but buttons where sometimes you pressed a left button before turning right, and vice versa,

The ML is absolutely fine at that. That's a simple problem to solve. Not that this has ML in it.

The redesigned Tesla model 3 has two buttons stacked on top of each other. The top one turns right and the bottom one turns left. This is stupid.

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 10:54 pm

I am personally more worried about shitty light cluster designs in some vehicles where you can't tell if it's a headlight or an indicator.

There are some where the indicator is small, in the middle of the head/parking light, and effectively not visible until it is too late to do anything about seeing it. There used to be standards, but that seems too passeé nowadays

I think the EU are "having enough of that shit" at the moment. Hopefully it'll catch.

bd139 wrote: ↑Sun May 12, 2024 7:38 am

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 10:54 pm

bd139 wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 9:54 pm

The cars still work the same as they always did.

The ML indicates before changing lanes?

ISTR there was something about some card not having indicator stalks, but buttons where sometimes you pressed a left button before turning right, and vice versa,

The ML is absolutely fine at that. That's a simple problem to solve. Not that this has ML in it.

The redesigned Tesla model 3 has two buttons stacked on top of each other. The top one turns right and the bottom one turns left. This is stupid.

I was probably conflating stalkless indicators plus ML plus ... Not relying on ML is a plus.

Which Tesla button do you press if you have stopped on a slight curve, or in a //parking space? The top/bottom/left/right button? Stupid doesn't begin to describe it.

tggzzz wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 10:54 pm

I am personally more worried about shitty light cluster designs in some vehicles where you can't tell if it's a headlight or an indicator.

There are some where the indicator is small, in the middle of the head/parking light, and effectively not visible until it is too late to do anything about seeing it. There used to be standards, but that seems too passeé nowadays

I think the EU are "having enough of that shit" at the moment. Hopefully it'll catch.

More sense from Europe.

The EU seems to allow the "Knight Rider" indicators (turn signals) which don't meet the requirements (all indicators must come on simultaneously) in the UK at least. This is particuarly true when the "moving light is splt across the rear quarter and rear hatch / boot.
Apart from that they are poor from a human physiology perspective. We are much more likely to recognise a rapid change in a complex scene than a gradual one. So a driver is less likely to notice these fashonable indicators. Conversly LED brake lights provide a improvement in driver response time because of their instant (relative to human sight response time) turn-on.
I think a lot of this started with CAD and computerised ray-tracing. In the "good old days" you had to design your light, build a prototype including making expensive moulds, and submit it to a lab for compliance testing. If it failed you started again. Because of this there was a reluctance to change light designs. Standard light designs, often from component makers like Lucas were used on many different cars.
At one point sealed beam headlights were mandated in some countries due to known perfomance.
Now the designers can design and model a light virtually. It appears that the approval authorities accept these virtual models.
There are requirements (in EU /UK at least) for spacing / relative brightness of co-located lights. I suspect that the requirements have not kept up with the new light sources.

Robert.

All agreed...

Robert wrote: ↑Sun May 12, 2024 9:47 am I suspect that the requirements have not kept up with the new light sources.

Especially the perceived brightness w.r.t. dazzling. There appears to be various UK campaigns to get the issue recognised.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/653793
https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/news/motori ... ght-glare/
and most problematic for politicians https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/petitions_ ... for-safety

I refuse to get involved with such metrology, since even Horowitz and Hill give up...

TAoE x-Chapters 9x22 Lumens to Watts (Optical)
Photometric quantities (lumens lux candela, etc) have got to be the most confusing measurements on the planet. They deal, variously, with...

bd139 wrote: ↑Sun May 12, 2024 7:38 am I think the EU are "having enough of that shit" at the moment. Hopefully it'll catch.

Not the EU but Euro NCAP, who have added physical controls for certain things to the next version (2026) of NCAP testing. So you can't get a top safety rating for your vehicle unless it has real indicators etc. There's no regulatory clout behind this, not yet anyway.