Fluke Friday - Going through the Fluke Collection

[TonyAlbus]

Starting to be a bit of a Fluke fan, before i did not care to much, but then i started buying a few.
Before i knew i was starting to be a collector (oh-no hand on forehead icon)
In that time i also was very confused about the whole multimeter series. 25/27 different from 21/23 and those then being same as 70 series.
So i decided to make a (almost) weekly video about a Fluke series. starting by the lowest number and going up the whole range i have.
starting with multimeter going to temperature, , oscilloscope, frequency counter , calibrators, just by number.

It is purely for entertainment and hopefully will help a few people having a better overview of the whole range.

Enjoy!

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Fluke Friday Videos:
FlukeFriday (E1) 7-600,1ACII : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSuUImdUin4
FlukeFriday (E2) 10,11,12 : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l45j8xR5kxo
FlukeFriday (E3) 12B : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cg1dIWeJYcY
FlukeFriday (E4) 25,27,8025B : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfpYTQjJRLg
FlukeFriday (E5) 30,32 : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jK2eOhPptis
FlukeFriday (E6) 37 : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSUDCPQSgjk
FlukeFriday (E7) 51, 62 Max: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-12-1uunZY
FlukeFriday (E8) 21,23 70,73,75,77,79 : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m36UhwglbAk
FlukeFriday (E9) 87-III and 787 Processmeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WUsE83NAmc
FlukeFriday (E10) 97 and 92B-Serie II Scopemeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zdYyARUDCQ
FlukeFriday (E11) 123 and 192 Scopemeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20_QyYVPbGY
FlukeFriday (E12) 91 Seire II Scopemeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKndt6yMXV0
FlukeFriday (E13) 164T Multifunction Counter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_-IbsbWjNU
FlukeFriday (E14) 287 in the AN/GSM-437 Army Kit : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGSKV_fip34
FlukeFriday (E15) 893A AC-DC Differential Voltmeter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QFrc0bB9ew
FlukeFriday (E16) 233 Multimeter Remote Display: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVLux8X_1YI
FlukeFriday (E17) 893A AC-DC Differential Voltmeter Part 2 : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MrFve95DI-k
FlukeFriday (E18) 867 and 867B Graphical Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmq5EBhbmKQ
FlukeFriday (E19) 1900A and 7200A Series Frequency Counter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EV2PyPuq9gA
FlukeFriday (E20) 81438 and 111 Special Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mz5ynDDLS8M
FlukeFriday (E21) APPA 203, it could be a 38 Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69gXoV6i8QI

FlukeOlderVideo - 87 III 87 V Brymen BM857s BM869s : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIAc_vfPkBg
FlukeOlderVideo - 187 Calibration Procedure : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UaCLKlZyQJ8
FlukeOlderVideo - 1900A Frequency Counter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiGQg9JKxYc
FlukeOlderVideo - 1920A Frequency Counter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FM6H5exQB0Y
FlukeOlderVideo - PM2812 Power Supply : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owhx7wW-mN8
FlukeOlderVideo - PM2534 Bench Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mmr6-NKht3c
FlukeOlderVideo - 5101B Calibrator First look : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQe2Y_KLi4g
FlukeOlderVideo - PM6662 120 MHz Frequency Counter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7YBCpDGc8M
FlukeOlderVideo - PM6685 RiFa Boom! : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6E1zjkZpj0c
FlukeOlderVideo - PM6685 8GHz Frequency Counter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gdZyfm7vOA
FlukeOlderVideo - 8000A 8010A Bench Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBqqhIAoaKU
FlukeOlderVideo - 8024A Handheld Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcbnaKOFOlE
FlukeOlderVideo - 8120A Bench Nixie Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPdngnfUaxw
FlukeOlderVideo - 8125A MilSpec Nixie Multimeter :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ko6Quk2e-F8
FlukeOlderVideo - 8200A Bench Nixie Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqbIjFfg2ns
FlukeOlderVideo - 8300A Lab Nixie Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5lR7kMGVufY
FlukeOlderVideo - 8500A Lab Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peC48lUX2rQ
FlukeOlderVideo - 8810A Bench Multimeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3_gYUEdURQ

And more to come

[MED6753]

Someone say Flukes? Here's my collection. Not as extensive as yours and it's exclusively DMM's and counters. On the bench1 is 8021B, 8060A, and 87. Above bench 1 is 8600A, 8050A, 8010A, 1912A, 1900A, and 8800A. Not shown on bench 2 is an 8000A and 7260A. And on the storage shelf is an 8505A.

[TonyAlbus]

Wow, nice collection MED!

[TonyAlbus]

It is Friday, FlukeFriday, this episode the Fluke 87 but a focus on the 787.

FlukeFriday (E9) 87-III and 787 Processmeter : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WUsE83NAmc
FlukeOlderVideo 87 III 87 V Brymen BM857s BM869s : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIAc_vfPkBg

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[Zenith]

Good videos as always.

I cheaped out and bought a Brymen BM867s. £50 less than the BM869s and the extra features weren't worth the extra money to me. I did buy the silicone leads sold separately, and they seem a step up on the ones included.

When I first got it, I compared my other three DMMs against it. Two were Maplins own brand (at one time they had a chain of electronics shops across the UK) and are about 30 years old. The other one is a UNI-T UT58C, which cost about £30 15 years back. I never really liked the UNI-T. The leads have stiffened and I replaced them with the ones that were included with the Brymen. On DC voltage they all agreed to within 1% with the Bymen and could be tweaked to agree closer. I was a little surprised they were so close after so long.

I'm pleased I bought the Brymen. It's much nicer to use, but very often, if I just want to check a voltage or continuity, I grab the closest.

For some reason I've never been tempted by Fluke although they've always had a top notch reputation.

[Specmaster]

I concur with the excellent BM867s, I never thought the extra £50 for the BM869 was worth the couple of extra features as I would never make use of them. The 500,000 count is extremely useful as IS the dual display, makes reading the ripple present on power rails a doddle. I also like the jack alerts if the leads are plugged into the wrong sockets for the switched range and the overall construction is I feel just as good as that on a Fluke device and give the feel that like the Fluke 25 / 27 ranges could also almost double as a brick and a hammer. That said, I do have 3 Flukes to 1 Brymen, but the Brymen is the only one I purchased new.

[Robert]

Fluke DMMs?
8010A
8022A
8022B
8060A Four of these, my favorite.
8845A
8920A
8922A
89IV
99 'ScopeMeter
25 x Two
10
11
16
Plus a few spares units.
I make that 17
Then there are HT probes, shunts, current clamps, differential voltmeter....

[mnementh]

I paid list for my pre-release 87 when I worked for Philips Lighting. Over the course of 6 paychecks, yes, but I still paid it because after using it for a month as my issued meter, I wanted to keep it that much. It was my daily driver and first at hand; whatever the gig, when it was set up on my bench next to my logbook, I was "ready to work". It never once let me down over almost 3 decades before it "vanished" during a move.

I call that unbeatable ROI. I have never ever regretted a penny spent on FLUKE or HP; I cannot say that for any other brand; even Tektronix.

mnem
Well, maybe MATCO and TEKTON... but that's tool of a different color.

[Specmaster]

I paid list for my pre-release 87 when I worked for Philips Lighting. Over the course of 6 paychecks, yes, but I still paid it because after using it for a month as my issued meter, I wanted to keep it that much. It was my daily driver and first at hand; whatever the gig, when it was set up on my bench next to my logbook, I was "ready to work". It never once let me down over almost 3 decades before it "vanished" during a move.

I call that unbeatable ROI. I have never ever regretted a penny spent on FLUKE or HP; I cannot say that for any other brand; even Tektronix.

mnem
Well, maybe MATCO and TEKTON... but that's tool of a different color.

-
You know, I reckon that you would say exactly the same thing if it had been a Brymen BM867s or BM869s, it has a similar rugged construction, similar drop test ratings, and heaps of other features that the Flukes don't have and also better accuracy and safety ratings such as a 500,000 count mode as opposed to a high of 20,000 count mode on a Fluke, 0.03% and 0.02% on the Brymen's, 25mF as opposed to 10,000uF (Fluke), 1MHz Brymen, 200KHz Fluke, 1,000V CAT IV (Brymen) and 600V CAT IV Fluke. Both of these Brymen's also have dual displays and a bar graph.

Dave has a video on these as well (but his Brymen is the lower spec/quality BM786)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Hlmq57FQQk

[Zenith]

Some tools are are clearly superior, are horribly expensive, but are something of a rite of passage for anyone expecting to be taken seriously in the field. There are good reasons why people relying for their living on tools buy expensive ones. There are limits and buying the name.

In the 60s in the UK, an AVO was what any aspiring TV technician would have to have. They are magnificent, well engineered things and I have two. Simpson was the same in the US. An apprentice earning £3.50 a week had to have an AVO, which cost £30 to be paid for by installments. The same was true with socket sets and mechanics; they had to have Britool set to be taken seriously. These days it's Snap Off toolsets. History overtook AVO. As a kid I was awed by the bloke turning up to fix our TV with an AVO, but mainly he was using it to check the continuity of valve heaters or check voltages at 20kR/V.

That was in the early 60s. By the late 60s the electronics rags were full of ads for meters from Japan; 1kR/V £1.50, 20kR/V, about £3, and more. I blew my wad on an Hioki 30KR/V - £4.50. I still have it and it's fairly accurate They didn't bother with aging magnets and like that. I think my 1960s tellies bloke would have had his mind blown by an el cheapo 1990 DMM. The AVO did go up 2.5kV and later 3kV. There were attachments for very high resistances. I have one in the loft.

I have nothing against Fluke, but Dave Jones went into why they were so expensive. I think Brymen is better value for money.

[mnementh]

The other thing you want to remember is that almost all of today's digital meters have technology derived from groundbreaking R&D done entirely or in part by FLUKE. Modern multimeters would be a very different thing without them.

Now as to whether they are comparable in manufacture and quality... I highly doubt even the top of the line Brymen would have survived 30 years of being in my toolbag working in literally a dozen different disciplines; I've seen the teardowns and there simply is no comparison in how robust the shell is, nor the integral quality of the PCB itself, nor how the PCB is mounted. Even the quality of the contact fingers in the rotary switch is visibly inferior to the FLUKE.

The question then is whether a person needs that difference. At least where my 189 is concerned, you bet yer bippy. I trust it more viscerally than I do my 3478A; it is my reality check against all other meters, just as a younger me felt of my 87. Everybody needs at least one meter they can feel that way about.

Now the 27... yeah, that was a vanity/nostalgia purchase. But also because it was a pristine, low hours set that was at at least once "calibrated" with the matching HV Probulators, which makes the whole also a thing of beauty, and a good reality check for things exceeding the capacity of my 189.

mnem
[FLUKE] sez "BAMMM!!!"

[MED6753]

Bought it new in 1997. Has never needed a calibration. Is my "go to" DMM. It may not have all the latest features of the new stuff or class leading accuracy but I absolutely trust it and has never let me down. And it did spend several years getting tossed around in a toolbox.

[mansaxel]

Hmm.

8020
8022 <- This and the 8020 are the start of "complete series of 80xx sidebutton collection"
8060a x 3 <- Favourite in 80 series, just as Robert mentioned. When I see one, I buy it.
10 <- my first own Fluke, bought for my own money, back in -94, still in my tool bag.
27 <- had to have it, just for the reasons mnem mentions; also with probulators
123 <- gifted to me 1995ish since I was AV engineer on the Swedish release party for it. So is first production series, software 1.0, never let me down, but on its 3rd battery pack and I've done strange things to the wall wart since it suffered an accident needing conversion to line lump.

Yes, Fluke is about dependability, longevity and boring reliability. (That last phrase stolen from power amplifier maker QSC whose products are just that.) Consequently, return on investment, peace of mind and sound night sleep, happyness et c rise to levels unseen.

I have other higher-end meters, more specifically hp 974a (i.e. Yokogawa) and Gossen MetraHit 25. They are close to daily drivers on the bench because they are very, very good. Yet, their legacy will always be that they're reactions to Fluke developments -- often reactions that surpass in performance while not sacrificing reliability. But still.

[Specmaster]

When it comes down to multi-meters, I have my foot basically in the best possible camps, those being Fluke (25, 27,x 2, 85, 8840A and 8842A), Brymen (BM867s), Avo (6 x Mk 8). And TMK (500 and 700, the 500 has been with me since I was 18 (55 years now) and has been used extensively in the harshest of environments, in the motor trade, living in my toolbox during my time working on over 130 buses, on oil field equipment in both production and on site servicing, and factory electrics installation and maintenance of heavy industrial machinery and is still going strong (not bad for a taut band analogue meter)) and also a Kyoritsu model 1400.

I have a slew of other meters as well I could mention, but they have not been subjected to the same level of use and abuse being either dedicated bench meters or more general purpose meters from the middle of the road makers, none of the cheap and nasty harbour freight type of thing.

True, nobody ever got fired for buying and using Flukes, and they are the defacto standard passage of rite in the industrial / commercial world if you really want to be seen as a safe pair of hands. But equally, the same used to be said, did it not, about AVO and Simpson meters years ago, so what happened to those? Like it or not, time marches on and bubbles get burst, and the status quo gets challenged and things evolve, so yes, my 2 handheld go to meters are of course Fluke 85 and the Brymen BM867s, the latter was in use yesterday in my volunteer work over at North Weald Airfield.

[mnementh]

Yes, and it will be very interesting to see which still functions after 30 years of bumps, drops and "sparky-type abuse" as my 87 survived; that's all I'm saying. I have confidence in the FLUKE because it has already done so. Don't know yet with the Brymen.

mnem

[Robert]

I paid list for my pre-release 87 when I worked for Philips Lighting. Over the course of 6 paychecks, yes, but I still paid it because after using it for a month as my issued meter, I wanted to keep it that much. It was my daily driver and first at hand; whatever the gig, when it was set up on my bench next to my logbook, I was "ready to work". It never once let me down over almost 3 decades before it "vanished" during a move.

I call that unbeatable ROI. I have never ever regretted a penny spent on FLUKE or HP; I cannot say that for any other brand; even Tektronix.

mnem
Well, maybe MATCO and TEKTON... but that's tool of a different color.

-
You know, I reckon that you would say exactly the same thing if it had been a Brymen BM867s or BM869s, it has a similar rugged construction, similar drop test ratings, and heaps of other features that the Flukes don't have and also better accuracy and safety ratings such as a 500,000 count mode as opposed to a high of 20,000 count mode on a Fluke, 0.03% and 0.02% on the Brymen's, 25mF as opposed to 10,000uF (Fluke), 1MHz Brymen, 200KHz Fluke, 1,000V CAT IV (Brymen) and 600V CAT IV Fluke. Both of these Brymen's also have dual displays and a bar graph.

Dave has a video on these as well (but his Brymen is the lower spec/quality BM786)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Hlmq57FQQk

The BM867 and 869 do NOT have better accuracy than the Fluke 87V. They claim basic DC accurcy as 0.02 / 0.03% +2d but that is only on the lowest two ranges. It is 0.15% +2d on the high range. The Fluke is consistent 0.05% +1d on all DC volts. The Brymen are 0.8% +60d for the 869 and between 0.3% +20 to 0.5% +40 for the 869 (45 to 300Hz) The fluke is 0.5% + 2 for AC.
When you read the rest of the Brymen specification the accuracy falls below 10% of range, the humidity is limited to 75% for quoted accuracy (maximum working is 80%). The Fluke is full range and 90%. Fluke accuracy is specified for 1 year. Brymen don't say.
Even worse is the EMI perfomace. At 3V/M the Brymen is +1000 counts (useless) the Fluke is 20 counts.
The extra digits on the Brymen are meaningless.

Sorry no contest, Fluke wins.

[Specmaster]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but surely the greater accuracy is far more important when you're working with low voltages, a few mV out on low voltage ranges when trying to calibrate something is crucial in some delicate equipment, whereas on higher voltage stuff being accurate to within a handful of mV's is far less important

Funnily enough I have just given my main meters that I use, a sanity check to see if there were any glaringly obvious errors among them indicating problems and the results show there are no problems on the horizon and the tables show pretty good collaboration between them and it also shows that meters do tend to have higher accuracy on the lower voltage ranges than on the higher ranges, but even on the higher ranges it is still pretty close tolerances.

Meter readings of main meters @ 29/1/23 Note, the 250/500 and 1000V values are the values printed on the tester rather than the actual values.
source device device device device device device device device
Insulation Brymen Fluke Fluke Fluke HP Blackstar Thurlby TTi
tester 867s 85 8840A 8842A 3466A 4503 1905A 1906
250V 265.161 265.3 265.04 265.03 265.1 265.13 264.98 265.09
500V 527.492 528 527.27 527.3 527.2 527.2 527.18 527.041
1000V 1034.41 O/L 1034.98 1034.01 1034.1 1033.9 1033.91 1034.42

AD584-M
2.5V 2.5001 2.501 2.5001 2.5002 2.5 2.5005 2.5006 2.5014
5V 5.0033 5 5.0035 5.0034 5.003 5.006 5.008 5.006
7.5V 7.505 7.51 7.5061 7.5062 7.505 7.508 70510 7.51
10V 10.008 10.01 10.009 10.009 10.007 10.013 10.012 10.014

[mansaxel]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but surely the greater accuracy is far more important when you're working with low voltages, a few mV out on low voltage ranges when trying to calibrate something is crucial in some delicate equipment, whereas on higher voltage stuff being accurate to within a handful of mV's is far less important

Yes. There are, realistically, very few things you can't do with a 3200 count meter, if it can measure the entity at hand. Hence, Fluke 27.

Funnily enough I have just given my main meters that I use, a sanity check

Under benevolent conditions, yes.

Back to what Robert wrote on reliability, yes it is what happens when the circumstances are not nice that matters. I agree. And there, Fluke has earned their respect in that.

Also, there is more to a measurement than the simple entity -- what are the frequency limits for AC, for instance? One of the reasons the Fluke 27 has the specs it has, is that it must be able to deal with 400Hz AC mains.

Not everything does.

The BM867 claims it does, and I am inclined to believe them, but look at the table! Accuracy is only decent within 45-300Hz.

The Avometer does, at least my "Test set, Multirange" which is an Avo 8 1/2, does. As it was the prescribed meter in the Bloodhound missile system, which uses 400Hz mains, it had to.

[mnementh]

The TL/DR is this:

There is a reason that when [FLUKE] sez "BAMMM!!!", we listen. Chiefly being that if all other variables are the same, it's going to say "BAMMM!!!" exactly the same, every. gawddamn. time.

mnem
That is what we're paying for.

[Specmaster]

The TL/DR is this:

There is a reason that when [FLUKE] sez "BAMMM!!!", we listen. Chiefly being that if all other variables are the same, it's going to say "BAMMM!!!" exactly the same, every. gawddamn. time.

mnem
That is what we're paying for.

Just the same as do all my other meters and I suspect do all the other highly respected brands out there. If it isn't a respected brand, then it doesn't make as far as my bench or become one that I often use, its confined to being one that I don't mind putting at risk, not a high energy risk though, but a mechanical damage risk, high energy risks are reserved solely for my Brymen or domestic energy, Brymen, Fluke handhelds, or my Extech MG302 which are designed for industrial use.

[mnementh]

Spec, I think you're missing the point... it is "that extra accuracy you don't see a need for" which makes for the "boring reliability" we're talking aboot and are willing to pay for. And willing to trust a piece of TE bought used to that degree.

And really... how can you have the same confidence in your Brymen, when as a company they haven't even existed as long as the 87x product line, and the lesser quality is visible to the eye in videos, and right there in the specifications?

The bottom line is whether you feel a need for that difference... not whether it really is a comparable piece of TE. It simply isn't.

And I say that knowing I have quite a number of both cheap chinesium meters and "decent" chinesium meters in my collection, and I consider any of them "adequate for general LV use".

I would similarly not have the same level of confidence in a used Keysight meter either, quite honestly. Too many shenanigans, both in the company and the resale markets.

mnem
damn, I miss the "tweak" emoji...

[Specmaster]

No, that is not what I'm saying, I'm actually saying is that while I fully accept that Fluke is a bloody good make of meter and hell, I understand that their quality is legendry, hence why I have so many of them in my collection. What I'm saying is that Fluke are not the only high quality maker out there, there are many manufacturers making quality industrial professional grade meters that are less expensive than Flukes, that can give just as good results, especially in the lower DC ranges and also in the lower AC ranges, which is where you will more than likely be requiring the precision. I cannot believe that equipment designed to run at higher voltages such as line voltages are going to be particularly fussed over whether they are running at say 230.152V or at 232.17V, it is always going to be much lower voltages where it could be that critical.

There are still loads of folk who manage with meters with a count of 3200 such as the venerable Fluke 27 so the fact that my Brymen has a 500,000 count in some lower ranges is not really a requirement or a must-have feature, it's more about ego boosting, bragging rights etc as are 7.5 digit meters or higher, very few of us will ever need such resolution, but we would jump at the chance of owning one at the right price, right?

As to whether a Brymen or other good quality meter will still be operational, and within spec in say 30 years time is pure conjecture at this point in time, but with Flukes costing in some cases 3 or more times their prices, what does it matter if you might have to replace them after 10 or so years, you'll be more up to date as a result.

[mansaxel]

No, that is not what I'm saying, I'm actually saying is that while I fully accept that Fluke is a bloody good make of meter and hell, I understand that their quality is legendry, hence why I have so many of them in my collection. What I'm saying is that Fluke are not the only high quality maker out there, there are many manufacturers making quality industrial professional grade meters that are less expensive than Flukes, that can give just as good results, especially in the lower DC ranges and also in the lower AC ranges, which is where you will more than likely be requiring the precision. I cannot believe that equipment designed to run at higher voltages such as line voltages are going to be particularly fussed over whether they are running at say 230.152V or at 232.17V, it is always going to be much lower voltages where it could be that critical.

There are still loads of folk who manage with meters with a count of 3200 such as the venerable Fluke 27 so the fact that my Brymen has a 500,000 count in some lower ranges is not really a requirement or a must-have feature, it's more about ego boosting, bragging rights etc as are 7.5 digit meters or higher, very few of us will ever need such resolution, but we would jump at the chance of owning one at the right price, right?

There is some hand-waving in this; but please bear with me. The core of the argument is not precision! Not per se. The question is certainty of deviation from stated performance. The Flukes are very clear about what they manage and not, and for a lot of conditions, they're quite tolerant. If one looks closely at the specs it is obvious that Fluke made some effort in only publishing the specs they can attain with a high degree of likelyhood under straining conditions. For Brymen, not so much. The loss of precision at 300Hz for AC, for instance. I can only see this as "oh, it does work up to 300Hz with some accuracy, let's publish that!" and since 400Hz is so common in mains, why not make it work? It smells.

As to whether a Brymen or other good quality meter will still be operational, and within spec in say 30 years time is pure conjecture at this point in time, but with Flukes costing in some cases 3 or more times their prices, what does it matter if you might have to replace them after 10 or so years, you'll be more up to date as a result.

Throwing things away is not my way of running a hobby these days. That's the "responsible" in "hoarder"!

[Specmaster]

No, that is not what I'm saying, I'm actually saying is that while I fully accept that Fluke is a bloody good make of meter and hell, I understand that their quality is legendry, hence why I have so many of them in my collection. What I'm saying is that Fluke are not the only high quality maker out there, there are many manufacturers making quality industrial professional grade meters that are less expensive than Flukes, that can give just as good results, especially in the lower DC ranges and also in the lower AC ranges, which is where you will more than likely be requiring the precision. I cannot believe that equipment designed to run at higher voltages such as line voltages are going to be particularly fussed over whether they are running at say 230.152V or at 232.17V, it is always going to be much lower voltages where it could be that critical.

There are still loads of folk who manage with meters with a count of 3200 such as the venerable Fluke 27 so the fact that my Brymen has a 500,000 count in some lower ranges is not really a requirement or a must-have feature, it's more about ego boosting, bragging rights etc as are 7.5 digit meters or higher, very few of us will ever need such resolution, but we would jump at the chance of owning one at the right price, right?

There is some hand-waving in this; but please bear with me. The core of the argument is not precision! Not per se. The question is certainty of deviation from stated performance. The Flukes are very clear about what they manage and not, and for a lot of conditions, they're quite tolerant. If one looks closely at the specs it is obvious that Fluke made some effort in only publishing the specs they can attain with a high degree of likelyhood under straining conditions. For Brymen, not so much. The loss of precision at 300Hz for AC, for instance. I can only see this as "oh, it does work up to 300Hz with some accuracy, let's publish that!" and since 400Hz is so common in mains, why not make it work? It smells.

As to whether a Brymen or other good quality meter will still be operational, and within spec in say 30 years time is pure conjecture at this point in time, but with Flukes costing in some cases 3 or more times their prices, what does it matter if you might have to replace them after 10 or so years, you'll be more up to date as a result.

Throwing things away is not my way of running a hobby these days. That's the "responsible" in "hoarder"!

I can understand that viewpoint to an extent if you were making your living with the meter, but as hobbyists it makes zero sense to me. If you do a periodic check on the meters drift etc, you will be aware of when its readings can no longer be considered reliable and take steps to either correct it or replace it. I can liken it to a desire to have a car that that is both extremely comfortable, powerful, posh and silent so you go out and buy a Rolls Royce, when it is a known fact that a Jaguar XJ6 is just as comfortable, powerful, posh and silent but costs fraction of the price but people steer clear of it because it does not have the same perceived quality and longevity of the Rolls Royce.

I still think of my Blackstar 4503 bench meter as being in very good condition and can still trust its readings to be pretty reliable and that is now at least 33 years old and still going strong, so yes, Flukes do last a long time and take a lot of abuse, my ones are now 30 years old, but then again so are the Thurlby 1905A, Blackstar 4503 and the HP 3466A and all pass the reference tests when applied to them. For that reason I say that other makers are just as good the Flukes, you just have to look beyond the perception that they are the holy grail. When it comes to personal protection in the event of an accident, they are great for that and I would trust them far more than I would say a Uni-T meter, but I'd also trust Brymen and the professional meters from Exotech.

[nixiefreqq]

YOU GUYS ALL MISSED THE POINT!

there is only one criteria for choosing any one meter over all others.

if you are in the fortress of solitude and a large rodent runs across your neat and tidy bench.......which meter will kill it in one shot?

we all know the answer to this question.